WHAT GREAT LEADERS DO DIFFERENTLY
Let's Talk, People: Episode 18
[00:00:00] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Hi, I'm Emily Frieze-Kemney, host of Let's Talk People, where leaders come to bridge humanity and profitability. Informed by a couple decades of work as a head of talent and leadership development, I'm here to amplify leaders so they can exalt everyone and everything they touch. Are you ready? Cause it's about to get real.
[00:00:28] Let's talk people.
[00:00:35] It is such a pleasure to have Marta Callao Molina on Let's Talk People. Marta and I go way back to our IBM days, where Marta spent 20 years of her career in various senior leadership roles within HR. She was chief of staff to IBM's CHRO, she was the global head of talent and leadership development for the company, and she was the HR leader for IBM technology sales.
[00:01:01] Marta is now a member of Citibank's HR leadership team, where she oversees and is responsible for HR for the U. S. Personal Banking Division, which is obviously a very significant business and highly dynamic for the bank. Marta has a true passion for fostering talent and helping organizations to grow and transform.
[00:01:23] The reason I thought it was so important for us to bring on Marta to talk to us is because engagement's hard. I think it's always hard under all circumstances, but especially when your organization is going through periods of change and transformation, which for many of us in our orgs can feel like it's constant.
[00:01:39] Do we give ourselves a pass on engagement and say, you know what, there's so much changing. Of course, people are not feeling good about working for me or working here. Or are there ways that we can continue to keep people engaged even as we're going through change? So let's get into it. I'm excited for it.
[00:01:56] Marta, it is so exciting to have you on Let's Talk People.
[00:02:00] Marta Callao Molina: Yes, I'm so happy to be here.
[00:02:03] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Thank you for inviting
[00:02:04] Marta Callao Molina: me.
[00:02:04] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: As you may know, I like, I like to go deep. We don't like those superficial talks over here. So we are going to take you somewhere that people don't often go when they talk about professional stuff, which is your childhood.
[00:02:16] Give us a little window into your childhood, just a little something that tells us about who you are.
[00:02:22] Marta Callao Molina: Oh my goodness. I am the youngest of three with a big age difference of seven and nine. So growing up, my favorite thing was just following and shadowing my siblings, especially my eldest sister. She was like the window of adulthood for me.
[00:02:39] So I would just sit there and watch her make up, get ready to go out. Or even if she was busy studying, I would just sit there and play with my stuff close to her so that it made me feel a little bit like being part of her. universe, right? And kind of tasting how it felt to be an adult. But one really thing that both of them helped with my childhood overall was that in my household, music was everything.
[00:03:04] And my sister and my brother were huge music fans, and they influenced me so big time. Like my life is a soundtrack every stage of the way I can relate. I remember being at home and had this mix of music My brother was obsessed with jazz and jazz fusion and my sister was more into the British 80s and 90s so I would hear Wet Wet Wet and Tears for Fears and Police and he was all there all the time so I became a huge freak of music and I am always with music.
[00:03:39] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Amazing. Okay. And we're going to now jump, jump to the current. What do you do? Tell us a little bit about your job and what you love the most about doing it.
[00:03:48] Marta Callao Molina: I think my job is amazing. I'm really, really lucky about it. And I've been lucky the jobs that I've, that I've done in my career because it gave me different perspectives.
[00:03:59] I was able to meet with tons of amazing number of interesting people. The role that I have today is a culmination of multiple things that I've done in my career, but it really touches everything related to HR, you know, in a totally different industry that I was used to. So I was. For 21 years in technology, now I'm in financial services.
[00:04:18] So I support the consumer business at Citibank, like around 22, 000 people. And it has different types of profiles. It has call centers and branches and mortgage and cards. And so it's very diverse. That's what I do today.
[00:04:33] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: And what do you think has really shaped how you show up as a leader today?
[00:04:38] Marta Callao Molina: First of all, I would be remiss if I don't say IBM was an amazing leadership school for me.
[00:04:43] 21 years, incredibly smart people. All of that really helped me be who I am today. No question about it. And I think the, the shift into moving into another industry is also shaping me on how do I adjust muscles? How do I see myself as everything that I exercise in one place? My curiosity was Is it going to work somewhere else?
[00:05:05] There's so much more cultures in different corporate America, and I didn't know that was going to work, so really adjusting to different contexts and stretching myself was wonderful. What I would say is, besides all the combination of experiences and people around me, I was very lucky to have great female mentors.
[00:05:23] And they were genuinely invested on my success and my growth very early back in Spain. I had a wonderful leader that just put me under her wing and then helped me. And, and, and really the moments that I had lows, that I had lack of confidence, she would just push me and push me. And it had multiple of those role models throughout.
[00:05:42] And now I feel like I need to give back. So every opportunity I have with younger women, I am there for them because I, I feel like I owe tons to the world to give back.
[00:05:53] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah, I always think about that concept that we're just one link in a chain. Yeah. And so it's, it's the people who have touched us. We play a part in this bigger system and then it's our role, obviously, to pass that baton and help uplift others.
[00:06:08] I, I love that.
[00:06:09] Abigail Charlu: Yeah.
[00:06:10] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: So that ability to think about leadership in community and how it's the leaders who have shaped us and how we shape others is a big part, I think, of what we do like we see where we fit into a system and what role we play in it and what we wanted to talk about is around engagement and what it feels like to work in an environment where there is tremendous change and transformation going on.
[00:06:34] I think it's almost always happening. It's almost rare now, the periods where things feel stable and constant. Yeah. And there's spikes, right? There are spikes of greater intensity, either driven by market events, catastrophic events can happen, war, environmental. There's a lot of things we see in organizations in terms of restructurings, re orgs, downsizing, strategy changes, getting into businesses, getting out of businesses, or even just a leadership change is, is significant.
[00:07:03] So what we wanted to just kind of frame up a little bit is for our colleagues, the other leaders out there in the world, let's, let's calibrate, like, what should you expect when you are leading through a period of change? How much grace should you really give yourself? How much is that really impacting the day to day engagement of your team?
[00:07:22] Marta Callao Molina: Well, I would say leaders deserve all the grace. Let me start by stating the obvious. Keeping your team engaged is not a small feat, and especially during times of change. And it's important to recognize that that engagement is not part of your responsibility solely, but there's a lot of external environmental factors that will influence that.
[00:07:43] So I think we need to put that into perspective. And we need to understand what is out of our control. That said, I don't think we need to find excuses, right? And get into this victim mentality that there's something else that is happening, and I don't have a part of it.
[00:07:59] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Right.
[00:08:00] Marta Callao Molina: So I think our role is absolutely critical in shaping the context.
[00:08:05] We have an opportunity to prioritize clarity and transparency. It is amazing the power that it gives when you create the psychological safety so people can be vulnerable. There's a lot of things that are out of our control, but I think how we show up, what's the type of culture that we want to cultivate with our teams is absolutely part of our responsibility, right?
[00:08:26] So I would say two things is yes, grace. It's not helpful to punish ourselves. And also, I think we need to take ownership. I think one thing that we've been discussing a lot at Citi is the concept of human centered leadership, right? And I loved it because it really is super helpful in terms of change because it talks about how to do hard things in a human way.
[00:08:50] That combination fascinates me because I think it's truly how I try to be as a leader where you need to be wise, you need to execute with excellence. And yet you can do it with empathy and compassion.
[00:09:02] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: I totally agree with you. So when we say this idea of being really conscious of how we show up as a leader and what you were just sharing about approaching things in terms of human centered leadership, maybe if you can give an example of how you've done that.
[00:09:18] Like what's an example as you've been helping either guide the business leaders that you're working with or your own team through change. What does
[00:09:26] Marta Callao Molina: it look like? I think it's important that you don't fake or hide things. I think transparency is key and that you bring your team along. Authenticity is the other key factor in my mind.
[00:09:41] You think about how do you want to feel through change, right? And you don't want your leader to be in a corner up in whatever floor giving you cryptic messages. In recent times where we had a lot of change, I think being authentic, it really ties very well with teams because it builds the connection.
[00:10:03] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah.
[00:10:04] Marta Callao Molina: The role of the leader is really understanding everybody's personality in your team and it's about meeting them where they are, right? So everybody needs different things. Sometimes I found easier for me to identify who are going to be on your company. To help you drive the change pretty quickly, your advocates.
[00:10:23] Right. So they can pedal with you and they could influence the others.
[00:10:26] Abigail Charlu: Yeah.
[00:10:26] Marta Callao Molina: I have instances in the past that over a period of a year and a half, they still like in shock, right? Of everything that has happened. So I think really meeting everybody where they are has been also super helpful.
[00:10:38] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah. As I was listening to you, the thing that was coming to me is sometimes we have to like, check in with ourselves and calm our nervous system so that we can.
[00:10:46] Think about what is it that other people need, because often we are looking at the world of work through our own lens and how quickly things are moving, the amount of pressure you're under as a leader, like how do you literally calm yourself, take a beat and think about how do I know if I'm giving people what they need.
[00:11:03] Is this the right level of transparency? Is too much going to make them anxious so that they can't perform? Too little, as you said, makes people create their own narratives, makes them feel scared and nervous.
[00:11:14] Marta Callao Molina: I think it's transparency both ways, right? And that was the part of the psychological safety piece, which is if you really create an environment where they feel like it be transparent with you, then you have very clear where they are.
[00:11:25] There's not like, there's no second guessing. There's like, I think I have an intuition. It's just two
[00:11:31] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: ways,
[00:11:31] Marta Callao Molina: right? So
[00:11:32] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: it's
[00:11:33] Marta Callao Molina: much
[00:11:33] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: easier. It's dialogue based and we're constantly checking in. I think that's really, that's really, really key. So when you think about these periods of change, And the fact that you are, even though you can't say is, I can say is for you are a proven test case that high engagement can be achieved during periods of change in terms of how you've led teams as well as how you've guided other leaders to do so.
[00:11:59] You now know it's possible. Okay, give us like the, the, the hot tips. What are some of the things that you're doing maybe more of differently or just the same when there is kind of acute change in the system?
[00:12:12] Marta Callao Molina: If you have opportunities like this, it is the perfect time to show off all the toolkit that as a leader you have all the capabilities that you have is the moment to show them.
[00:12:22] Right. And I think that takes time to build over the years. I see absolutely. The change as an opportunity. And I, I think I mentioned some of them, but to me, when I have change, it's changing for you. Right. So That's right. I, I think it's important that. Your team understands that even you're leaving the boat, you're also feeling the storm, right?
[00:12:45] Yeah. Yeah. Again, I come back all the time to the same things, but being vulnerable about it. That to me is helpful. I have a lot of honest conversations. Every time I have an opportunity, I reiterate direction and what's the north star. I repeat the context. I open my door for conversations all the time and how people feel.
[00:13:08] I sometimes have hard conversations about what is not going to look like because the tendency is just to also get into the positives. But I think being true and balanced, what's coming is, is also, is also very, very important. And then I think really focusing on action, right? I like the concept of compassionate because he's defined by you have empathy, but that doesn't stop you to action thing.
[00:13:33] So it helped me think I feel how you feel. So let's agree with that. But immediately I get into the solution. And so how do we. Get us unstuck, right? How do we move to the next thing? Whoever is getting to that place, if you co create with them, you test things with them, they are your sounding board. I asked the members of my team, how do you feel others will feel if I do this or the other?
[00:13:59] So I had those conversations. And they are super keen to have them with me, right, because then they are part of it. They have a voice.
[00:14:06] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: That's right. I think that there's two things that you said that I wanted to just highlight. That part about asking them, how do you think others will feel about this, I think is such a key tip.
[00:14:17] Because it gives them a safe way to also include how they're going to feel without having to always call it out directly. You can say, well, what I'm hearing is or what I'm noticing is, but you know, it's also their voice included in that. And that makes it safe. So I think that's really essential. And I think the other thing that leaders miss on that you called out, that's really important is when you only talk about the positive, I think that's an example of when.
[00:14:44] You don't show authenticity. I think that when you're going through change, it's not all going to be easy. The outcome. Is, let's say, exciting, desirable, energizing, especially for the people who have been a part of making that strategic decision. For the people who are on the receiving end of the decision, or impacted by it, there is a variety of feelings, and I think that that is a way that you demonstrate empathy, is by talking about the variety of things that you're feeling that other people might be feeling, and the good and the bad of it.
[00:15:16] Marta Callao Molina: Yeah, totally agree. Um, I think I've seen leaders getting trapped into let me give you all this propaganda. Yeah. And then people disconnect immediately because then you already are sensing that is fake. We don't like fake. Nobody likes fake, right?
[00:15:32] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: That's right. All right. I'm going to turn it over to Abigail on our Let's Talk People team to share some of the questions that we've got from leaders.
[00:15:42] Abigail Charlu: Thanks, Emily and Marta. We have some feelings, some questions, some situations around engagement from, from our leaders and managers. One manager posed this situation. They said, I'm feeling a little bit exposed since some of my engagement scores are lower than I had hoped. What parts do I need to show ownership for, and where is it appropriate to push back?
[00:16:09] I don't want to come off as defensive, but I know some of this is really about the culture.
[00:16:16] Marta Callao Molina: As I said previously, I think I am a big proponent on transparency and vulnerability. So. I becoming defensive is not going to take you anywhere and it's a normal reaction. Yeah, it's a human reaction, but I would say just go, you know, take some time, go back home rested, digested, but defensiveness it's and then you also get into this personal dynamic that is personal.
[00:16:43] So you get into a degree that I don't think is very constructive. So I would say, I think we all need to take ownership on on on those things. Um, I personally would take it with a lot of curiosity, what is exactly that data is telling me? I would open up all ears and understand what's really causing this, what's the, what's the roots, the root cause of this, and what is within my control, what is not?
[00:17:10] But the last thing I would do is blame it in the bigger picture or others, or I would just take a very balanced way of humility and advocacy. At the same time when you talk to people and acknowledge that you can also put in context everything else that's happening because we should not be afraid to to name some of the broader factors so you really helping them demonstrate that you understand the whole thing that you're willing to grow that you understand the full picture, but also you take ownership right?
[00:17:42] So I think that's the tone I would use.
[00:17:45] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah, I like that. I think it's a Very common trap because not only is it a little bit of a feeling of being exposed, your leader might see the data, your people partner, your HR partner is going to see it. Like, I think there is a little bit of that, like, I want to be perfect.
[00:18:00] We all want to be perfect. And none of us are perfect. That it's very easy to see Well, it's just one or two people on my team who just have it out for me. They wanted my role. They don't like me. They don't want to work hard, and I'm making them work harder. There's a lot of narratives. And then your point as well, Marta, like the excuse making of like, what was me?
[00:18:17] It's it's the culture. It's my leadership. It's leadership in general. That's all true. Like, let's just name all of that could be going on. Yeah. I think. Where we get lost in it is do you actually care to make it better? And most leaders do, they do want it. They do want to be a good leader. They do want their people to be motivated and engaged and high performing.
[00:18:38] So just come back to that desire. I want to be as good as I can possibly be. And I am imperfect. And I think that when you come at it from that, as you called it, like place of curiosity, it's like the energy shifts. Absolutely.
[00:18:54] Abigail Charlu: Well, along that theme, let's say someone thinks that their engagement scores are being brought down by one or two people, would you recommend they confront those individuals and have a one on one discussion about their feelings or their participation, their levels of engagement, their feeling towards their manager?
[00:19:15] How would you recommend that manager engage with those individuals or do they?
[00:19:20] Marta Callao Molina: I had so many times in my life as a leader, you know, those moments, because typically, you know, you have your span is small, right? So one or two people will bring them down and you will be like, Oh, with all the efforts I made, you know, all the things that I thought I'd made the right approach and then it's a bummer, right?
[00:19:39] And I've, I've, I've been there multiple times, but also is a challenging in a positive way. How do I now strategize this? You don't want to give up. Obviously confronting again, coming back to blame and that I don't think is constructive or is going to take you in any way positive. I think the way I've approached it in the past is I try to build stronger relationship with them.
[00:20:05] I try to invest more time with them because sometimes I'm like, this is because I didn't spend enough time to get to know them. So that it didn't allow me to adjust, I didn't understand what they needed from me. So, first of all, it's like, let's look inside and see what could have done differently, but then start exploring with them a little bit more.
[00:20:26] Not in a confrontational way, but more about getting to know them better. A little by little, reinforcing a little bit more that relationship. They get to know you better. They, they get to know you, the, the why's you do things. So it's more about just reinforcing the relationship, I think, and starting a more constructive dialogue.
[00:20:46] Use the, the platform or the bigger group to, to get to know what's going on as well, be very receptive and be a big listener, because sometimes we tend to be too busy to listen carefully to our team members. So that's what I would say.
[00:21:03] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: I think we underestimate. The foundation of relationship health. I think we skip over it.
[00:21:10] We get right into the work. We think it's work. How personal do we really need to get? What does that look like? I don't think people really even know what relationship building at work looks like. And I could even argue maybe we don't know how to do relationships in any part of our lives. Like we were never taught it, right?
[00:21:22] So
[00:21:24] Marta Callao Molina: you're being very pessimistic today.
[00:21:27] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: But it's exactly where you're going, Marta. If you think that someone is not responding well to your leadership or is just not fitting to you. Meet. Into the team, and maybe that as a result is impacting their perceptions or their performance or both. I think you get curious about who they are.
[00:21:43] I love that. I think that's really, really key. I think we can come at it imagining how would you approach that conversation, which the people who are a part of our Let's Talk People community are always really curious about. Give me the language, right? I know that I have to give something different to each of you on the team to be an effective leader, which is one of the harder parts of leading.
[00:22:02] So there's things we do because we have a team and we're trying to do things consistently, but I want to understand you and I want to understand what I can do more of differently to make it even easier for you to be successful here. Coach me on how I can help you like I really want to understand what that can look like from your lens and I'm going to do my best to adjust where I can to help you to shine.
[00:22:29] Marta Callao Molina: Absolutely. I had a lot of new team members coming to my team a year ago or so, and I think it's important that you start the journey. Of getting to know the teams and asking them to get to know each other very early, have to be very intentional about it on the, on the norming and the forming and do a lot of interventions to get to that point.
[00:22:52] So, if you do the right steps, I think you get less of what you just described, Abby, right? Because you're not giving them that space and it gets to a point that they know you so well, and you know them so well, and you created such a level of respect for each other that. They wouldn't do that, right? But, but I think you have to be very strategic about it since the beginning, right?
[00:23:14] On how you build team dynamics.
[00:23:16] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah, and you have to frame that in your own mind, for those of us who are very driven and task oriented, that that is a part of the work, and that will make the work work better.
[00:23:26] Marta Callao Molina: Oh, so that is a great investment of your time, and it's not that you're done in a year. Team members come and go, and so you need to constantly do that, but if you do the right things at the beginning, it really helps tremendously.
[00:23:38] Abigail Charlu: Absolutely. Another manager shared candidly, you know, honestly, my own engagement has been really low recently. Do I fake it with my team? Do I share some of what I'm feeling?
[00:23:53] Marta Callao Molina: I truly believe leadership is not about pretending you're perfect. I think it's about showing that you're human and you have also your lows.
[00:24:04] I personally have shared with team members in the past when I felt overwhelmed, when I was too busy to even eat, and I was in a bad mood, and when I was exhausted, when I was frustrated. I did that, but I've been very selective to whom I was able to do that. They will understand that you cannot be 100 percent energized 24 by 7.
[00:24:25] That's a reality, right? And there's, there's some leaders that are there that way. I am not. And also I talk to my peers and sometimes I just go to my husband and say, I just want to cry and that's fine. We all have an ecosystem of people and I think you can choose who to, to surround you with and to help you and support you.
[00:24:45] But I would be. I would be absolutely open, and I've done it in the past, and I think, again, it shows them how human you are, and you are vulnerable, and then, it is amazing what it does, because some of them will absolutely jump and help you out immediately. I mean, generosity comes immediately into play, and it doesn't come from managing up.
[00:25:07] It comes truly, generally, because they want to help you.
[00:25:10] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: I want to stay on that last point that you made, and then I'm going to work backwards. I think, We underestimate how good it feels for members of our team to help us. I come from, and I know you're the same, Marta, and a big reason why I wanted to bring you on for others to get to know you, which is like this form of leadership where you really think about your impact on other people.
[00:25:33] And we know that as leaders, our impact is bigger than we even like to believe and imagine. So we do a lot of emotional care and feeding for people. This idea of being able to show that you're not perfect. I think sometimes we hold up leaders as if they're flawless and always poised and it makes it hard for you to show your own need.
[00:25:59] For guidance, or that I don't know how to do something, or I mess something up if you hold the bar too high, so I think it's really helpful for us to kind of be real. That really resonated with me. And then I think that where I have a little bit of a boundary, and I might lean almost too far in the Yeah.
[00:26:16] Yeah. Protecting people from how I'm feeling camp because I'm kind of such a caretaker. So this is probably something I I've had to work on myself over time, but I'd say, I think it's okay for me to say that I'm frustrated or I'm having a day and show some commonality, but I still want to provide hope. I feel like that's where we usually draw the line as leaders is real.
[00:26:41] And with a variety of emotions, but the emotions again come out more in the form of words and reflection versus outbursts or emotional reactions. And then it's almost that little bit on the end, which is going to be okay. We're going to get through this. Let's just take it one day at a time, like whatever it is that it's like helps people to put it in perspective.
[00:27:00] Marta Callao Molina: I love that. What I use a lot is sense of humor, sarcasm and cynicism. It helps because It comes from a place where you, you don't want to laugh, but almost want to laugh. Yeah. And I think it helps kind of minimize a little bit what you just share. And yeah, I think humor in the workplace has to be a mandate.
[00:27:21] I totally agree. It's a must. It's a
[00:27:23] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: must. If you don't have a sense of humor, I don't know what to do with you. So true. So true.
[00:27:29] Abigail Charlu: I think as we wrap up this portion in, in general, managers are just looking for some questions to ask to improve their team's engagement. You've already given us quite a few examples, but if you want to just touch on any other questions to engage those team members, knowing that people are always cautious with what they share with their managers.
[00:27:54] Marta Callao Molina: First of all, I think frequency is good. Because they cannot escape, you ask them so many times that at the end, they will, they're going to give up and give you something. Right? So frequency would be one thing, but then it is about how you ask. So again, I try to be sometimes generic. Do you think the team requires to move on?
[00:28:17] What do you think the team would benefit from? From my leadership perspective, I would even. Use some triggers on things that I haven't been doing maybe super well. So, you know, throw that and see if they catch it. Every time we have performance discussions, I always said to them, I'm going to give you feedback, but I really need feedback from you and.
[00:28:39] And we have those two ways conversation open and then questions frequency creating the permission. What you cannot do is if they provide you feedback and you react, then you're lost. You're lost. You lost every single bit of trust that you build. So I think the moment they give you feedback and they see you acting upon that, then every time you'll ask them.
[00:29:03] They will give it to you. That then creates that wonderful loop of trust.
[00:29:08] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: I think that's exactly right because they know you take it seriously. I think related to that, you have to be prepared when you go into these conversations that they might say things that you consider personal. You either implemented them.
[00:29:21] You are a sponsor of them. It's the way you've operated for a long time. So I think one of the self talk elements. So this is kind of like the thing you say in your own head before you go into the session is my greatest success as a leader is helping my team to make this place even better. And that should go beyond what I've done.
[00:29:39] So I think if you frame it up that way, it helps you to be in the right mindset of they should try to break everything we've put in place to make this place better. And that will go beyond what I know. Yeah.
[00:29:49] Marta Callao Molina: Yeah, and I think when you get to a point in your career where you've proven yourself, not others, but yourself, that you've been able to do a lot of things, and And such, I think by force, you get, you become much more generous, right?
[00:30:03] Because there's no, there's not an agenda that puts. You that much up front, but it really is done and it's much fun because it's less pressure, less stress. And, and then the, the authenticity comes along. You don't have to make any effort because there's no, there's no pressure that you're imposing yourself because you already had all those years of pressure.
[00:30:27] Yeah. I always enjoy seeing other people thrive and just run yourself with smart, intelligent, and hungry people that they just want to. succeed, and that's a lot of fun.
[00:30:39] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Yeah, that's how I feel like I've always said the more I can give away the better, because as a leader, there should always be the next thing that you're looking to to do.
[00:30:48] Yeah, I think in terms of specifics, one of my favorite questions is just give me one Thing that you think we could do to make it even better in terms of how we function as a team or to improve this process, our ways of working, like whatever is the follow on piece. But when you say, just give me one thing, one thing feels okay.
[00:31:08] All right. One thing's not so bad. I can say one thing. It makes it bite size enough that people will be honest with you. The other thing is you can tie it back to performance, which is, you know, we're showing up. We're giving so much of our lives to work. We do all of us do. How do we make the most of our time together?
[00:31:27] Like, we're going to be here. We're going to be we're committed. How do we make this the best Experience for one another and feel really proud of the results that we drive like what it would it take because you're tying together the fact and which is kind of the whole belief system behind the work that we do that you can be thriving and happy and energized by getting stuff done and having an impact like they go together.
[00:31:54] So what do we need to do to make it like you're so pumped to come to work?
[00:31:59] Abigail Charlu: Those are great. Love those questions. Thanks for the questions and the practical advice from the both of you.
[00:32:06] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: So, Marta, as you know, one of the things we are here to do is to help leaders to break patterns. And what we mean by pattern breaking is you are feeling like you're in a system where things are frustrating.
[00:32:21] You feel stuck. You feel like it's just repeating over and over. And instead of abdicating responsibility for it, you find Your your way, you find your agency in it, and that's what we encourage everyone to do, regardless of their level of leadership is to find their ability to reclaim their agency and become a pattern breaker.
[00:32:39] When you think about yourself as a leader, what do you believe is the pattern that you are here to break?
[00:32:44] Marta Callao Molina: I think it's a very good question, by the way, I think the fact that this belief that leaders have to have all the answers and the humanity of it, I think is one and then really about. What we talk about human center and they believe that you can really do things in the workplace with all the time, the human touch.
[00:33:06] You can help people thrive and develop and grow and yet get the results that you need. And I think many, many times I've seen that human part of it get lost in the way. So if you ask me, I mean, what I would like my legacy to be just to leave a workplace that is more human. And I think we've had some, some illusion about that when we had COVID back in the day and then that everybody was a little bit more, more level up and they open up much more.
[00:33:36] And again, I think we're just losing it again a little bit. So I would love that. If you do that, and that scales, it's not about your team, it's your organization, it's everything. So it's contagious and it makes a better world. So that's what I believe.
[00:33:53] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: Well, and that's exactly why you're here. So thank you for being you and thank you for showing what that looks like in reality and for being that type of leader because we sure know we need more of it right now.
[00:34:05] So thank you and thank you for joining us. Really appreciate it.
[00:34:09] Marta Callao Molina: Thank you both. It was a real pleasure.
[00:34:13] Emily Frieze-Kemeny: That conversation with Marta really got me pumped up about our role as leaders because we're always trying to improve engagement and yes, it can feel more important and more acute and we're going through periods of intense change.
[00:34:27] But I think this is always where we bring our focus and some takeaways that I have from our conversation were about the role of transparency. We talk about transparency a lot, but I think the way that mark to describe what it really looks like is a frequency. There's a frequency to which we are providing updates, bringing people along, reminding them of the decisions and direction.
[00:34:51] The other was transparencies about not. Being perfect as a leader in terms of your own feelings and experience and trying to really lead from a place of that strong human touch, really connecting in with people, trying to demonstrate empathy and understanding of what it might be like to walk in their shoes.
[00:35:09] I think that this idea that relationships is the foundation to do that is really overlooked at work, and that should be done at the beginning if you are no longer at the beginning, you can always build that in and spend more time really trying to understand people, what drives them, what makes them tick, how they like to receive feedback, how they like to be managed, what they like to work on, cannot do enough of that, and then equally sharing more about yourself and how you lead so that there's no guesswork.
[00:35:36] I think related to sharing more about ourselves, part of what goes on for us is we have lots of feelings at work, the same way we're accountable to helping all of these people navigate, engage, and feel engaged. You know, we have to work on our own engagement, and if you're having a lot of feelings, it's okay to share some of it, as long as it's not to the degree that people lose belief and hope that things are going to be okay.
[00:35:57] But that, you know, when we are, um, needing to process, that's where having a really good colleague is the best, knowing when to bring it outside of work and, you know, bring it home and talk to, you know, people in your life who are maybe not in it, the dynamic with you can be really helpful and to just approach Each day at work from this place and desire that you really want to make things better.
[00:36:20] And to make things better means you have to believe that other people on your team have a better way at times than you can even imagine. I think as Marta said, that archetype of, you know, the leader having to be the best, the all knowing is of the past. And I think it's a limiting belief. So the idea is how do I get so excited about the insights and genius of my team members.
[00:36:43] Even the ones that confront the way I've been doing things is powerful medicine
[00:36:52] and let's talk people. What we love to do most is help you unpack your toughest people management challenges. So send them in, send in the situations you're struggling with. Questions that you have about leading your teams, and we will anonymize them and give you answers and our advice on an upcoming episode.
[00:37:12] You can write them an email or attach a little audio message with your scenario to abigail@arose group.com. That's Abigail a B I G a I L at arosegroup, A R O S E G R O U P .com. Thanks for joining today's episode of let's talk people. For more info and insights, visit arosegroup. com and find me, Emily Frieze-Kemney on LinkedIn and Instagram.
[00:37:43] If you're enjoying the show, please follow, share on social and leave a rating or review in your podcast app. It helps other listeners to discover us. Well, that's a wrap friends until next time when we come together to talk people.
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